We talk with Ralph Finizio of GAF roofing about roofing
materials, warranties (including GAF's own 50-year warranty), how GAF selects,
trains and inspects contractors, and what you should look for in a qualified
roofing contractor.
John Maher: Hi,
I am John Maher and I'm here today with Brett Rogenski, General Manager of
Master Roofers, the most trusted roofing company in New Hampshire for over 80
years. Welcome Brett.
Brett
Rogenski: Thanks, John. Thank you for having me today.
John: Sure.
And our special guest today is Ralph Finizio, Senior Care Trainer and Roofing
Academy Instructor at GAF, North America's largest roofing and waterproofing
manufacturer. Welcome, Ralph.
Ralph Finizio: Thank
you. It's a great opportunity to be with both of you today.
About GAF's Roofing Materials
John: Yeah,
so Ralph, before we get into "choosing a roofing contractor", which is our
topic for today, a solid roof starts with quality materials. Can you talk a
little bit about GAF and your roofing materials?
Ralph: Yes.
So GAF has been around…I think this year is the 138th year. And if we look
back, we really take credit for pioneering the roofing industry, going way back
to the very late 1800s when we manufactured the first rolled roofing, if you
will. And as you look through the history of our company, we had a lot of
firsts. First company to use granules in roofing. We were the first company
that really cut that rolled roofing into shingle shapes.
In 1967, to kind of speed up a little bit, we're the
company that invented the architectural or laminated shingle as we know it
today. And as we continue to evolve, GAF has always been in the leadership role
of trying to be one step ahead of technology to improve these products, the way
they perform, how they handle.
And as I look at today's environment, from my perspective,
I joined GAF in 1984 when I think that the industry was a little bit more
mechanical, if you will, where adjustments were being made to those machines by
dials and men. And today they're basically supercomputers that make roofing and
the quality today is just outstanding.
John: Brett,
from your perspective at Master Roofers, what does the name, the brand name of
GAF, mean to you, and that 130 year history?
Brett: Well,
it's funny you bring up the history. So between our two companies, I think we
have a combined 220 years in roofing, with ourselves having, I think at this
point, 82 years in roofing, coupled with your century plus of experience. And
what it means is quality, it means consistency, and it means a high grade
product.
And speaking for Master Roofers, again, we've been doing
this since 1942, we could align ourselves with any major manufacturer. We
choose to align ourselves with GAF because of those things, because they
represent the same values that we do, which is high quality, high value,
consistent, and process based. You were talking about the process of
manufacturing. Well, as you know, there's a real clear process for proper
application that gives homeowners the best result. So to me it's about quality,
consistency and doing the thing for that homeowner that's going to give them
the best result humanly possible.
Ralph: And
it's a team. Really, we manufacture products, we don't know where they
ultimately end up. We don't know who's installing them. So when we have
relationships with companies like yours, it's the combination of your expertise
in assembling the system correctly, along with our quality, that makes it work.
Brett: Yeah,
that's a great way to put it, assembling the system correctly. Because you're
right, anyone could make their way to a big box store and buy some GAF
shingles. What happens with them afterwards is what makes a lot of the
difference. Great, you can take a super quality product and then go misapply it
and you have a poor roof as opposed to using an actual certified GAF roofer.
Ralph: Right.
And as I like to say, if you do it wrong, you can't take it off the roof and
put it back in the box and return it like a toaster. Usually my phone starts to
ring with people that are like, "We hired this guy. He said he knew what
he was doing. I thought he was. And then the house is just a disaster."
And there's no remedy for that. Most likely it's going to have to be redone.
GAF Certification and the
50-Year Warranty
Brett: No,
you're absolutely right. And that's also why we love being part of your
certification process. We happen to be a master elite certified roofer, which
is…I think in the, what, Ralph, I'm going from top of my memory, top 2% of
roofers in the nation? We take pride in that. And it's because we're going to
do a great job for people every single time. We're not Fred the handyman who
swung by the big box store and grabbed some shingles, and hucked them up, and
comes with a 5/1 discount.
John: Yeah.
So Ralph, I understand that GAF has a 50 year warranty on certain roofing
materials when they're installed by certified contractors like Brett was just
talking about. Can you elaborate a little bit on the specific criteria a
roofing contractor needs to meet to qualify for this extended warranty program?
Ralph: Yeah,
sure. There's a lot to it. First of all, what we've done over the course of
time, since really 1997 when we first launched this Master Elite program, is
we're trying to pair up, because we don't install, we just manufacture. And our
ultimate goal is to make sure the consumer who invests in a new roof gets what
they paid for and gets that long-term performance.
And so what we've done over the course of time is, because
we trust the people that are installing our products more than, say, pickup
truck Pete, who very well may be a decent mechanic, but he doesn't have the
longevity, the history, the financials, he doesn't have the back office
support, the overhead, probably doesn't have insurance and workers' comp. He's
probably not OSHA compliant as well. So when you bring that all together and
we're starting to work with legitimate, reputable contractors who they themselves
don't want to have failures, he wants to go to the grocery store on the weekend
and not be harassed by people that he's had issues with. He wants to go to the
grocery store or the hardware store, whatever, and have people come up to him
and say, "Hey, my buddy at work wants a roof."
So, the ultimate protection that we try to provide is, all
of our roofing shingles and systems now come with a lifetime warranty, which
means it truly never expires. And I'll get into that in just a second. But
we're so confident in our quality and their ability to install according to our
application instructions, which is clearly labeled right on the Golden Pledge
Warranty document itself. There are steps that we ask them to follow. And when
all of that happens, the warranty that they can issue to a consumer provides a
full 50-year, 100% non-prorated coverage against manufacturing defects.
And now, it's a systems warranty, not a shingle warranty.
So, if any component in that assembly, and we will stay on the assembly, has a
manufacturing defect, we're going to replace that entire slope. Everything
goes. And additionally, we provide more financial support where we're going to
provide additional labor to reinstall new products. We're going to pay for the
tear off costs and the disposal costs. So in the unlikely event that we had a
catastrophic failure on a roof, there's a lot of financial return to that
consumer to get them back whole again.
Brett: We
think that the Golden Pledge is an amazing warranty. And to Ralph's point, it's
really about that entire assembly system. It's not just a warranty on a
shingle, it's that entire system, and that's why we follow that process. That's
why we are a Master Elite contractor, so that we can offer that to our
homeowners, to our customers who want to do that.
Think about that as a homeowner. If you choose to work
with someone like Master Roofers and GAF and you choose to pursue a Golden
Pledge Warranty compliant roof, 50 years you are protected. 50. You could be 20
years old moving into your first house and you don't have to worry about this
till after you're retired.
Ralph: And
the warranties are fully transferable within the first 20 years. So I'm about
ready to put new HDZs on my house. I'm going to get a Master Elite who's done
my last two houses. I'm going to get a Golden Pledge, because when I transfer
my house to my kids, they're going to get the workmanship.
Brett: Sure,
absolutely. And it's a tremendous warranty. It's a tremendous system. And more
importantly, it's the peace of mind behind that, to know that, yeah, you've got
GAF who's going to back this product, but also that they're so sure about the
folks who installed it that they're willing to do that as well. So it's not
just, to your point, it's not just a product, it's a system. It's an ecosystem
really, of the installing company, the product, and then the entire assembly
that's done there.
We're also kind of proud of the fact that, again, in an
industry where I think the average roofing company has a life expectancy of
something around 4 years, we've been at it for 82 years. So, a lot of times,
when folks ask us about warranties, they're like, "Well, what if 10 years
from now I have an issue?" We're like, "Well, just call. We've been
here for 82 years, we intend to be here for another 82."
The Golden Pledge Workmanship
Provision
Ralph: But
there's another major component to our warranties that Brett talked about is
you have the material coverage but we also, in the Golden Pledge, include a
workmanship provision which, based on the loyalty factor of your company with
us, we're going to basically own your rooftop liability. Okay? So it not only
provides a 50 year, 100% non-prorated term for material defects, it also
provides that homeowner with a 25 year warranty against workmanship errors. So
one of his crews has a bad couple minutes and he just drifts off for a minute
and he doesn't flash a pipe or a penetration that causes an issue down the
road, we're going to pay them to go back and fix their own little mistake. So
that's the liability factor that we take on.
And then you talk about "follow the money trail". I teach
contractors this all the time, is talk about the financial responsibility.
Because Johnny Smith Roofing, the little guy in town, might be an excellent
mechanic, might be a nice guy, coaches Little League baseball. I mean, who
knows, right? But he's going to give that customer a warranty of say, maybe 10
years of workmanship. What if he's not in business within that 10 years? What
if he changes his industry and says, I'm done with roofing, I'm going to
flooring, or I'm going to become a landscaper, it's easier. Or he just closes.
There's no money sitting there in the name of that homeowner in an accrual
account in some bank in the unlikely event that something happens to that roof
from a workmanship installation standpoint. The 25 year period for the Golden
Pledge, GAF, North America's largest roofing manufacturer, 6 billion plus in
sales is the bank on that house.
Brett: Yep,
absolutely.
Ralph: So
that's where the money falls in. And that's really the benefit of the Golden
Pledge is what if, who's going to take care of this? What are the parties that
are involved? Where's the checkbook?
Brett: Unfortunately,
we get to meet some folks time to time and it's not how we want to grow our
business, but they worked with someone who's no longer solvent. They did not
choose something like GAF and the GAF Golden Pledge, and they're three years
into a roof that they paid good money for and now, like you say, Pete in the
pickup is gone. It's a brand that does not back itself the way GAF does. And we
get the unfortunate news of telling them that maybe they have a costly repair
or whatever that is. And our business, we perform repair, some roofing
companies don't. We do, but that's not how we like to meet people. So it does
happen, Ralph.
Ralph: I
know.
Brett: It's
unfortunate, and again, we don't like to be the bearer of bad tidings to folks,
but again, that's all part of the decision that you're making up front when you
choose your contractor and you choose the company you're going to work with for
those roofing materials.
Ralph: And
our installations require full systems. What you're competing against in many
cases is a contractor who may like Timberline HDZ shingles, but he's putting
all off-brand ice and waters and underlayments and ridge vents, and it's not a
system anymore. So it's a totally different animal when you're offering a
customer the financial protection and your skill set to assemble this roofing
system correctly.
Tools and Resources to Match
Homeowners with Certified Contractors
John: So
,Ralph, Master Roofers, as Brett mentioned, has an 82 year history of providing
quality roofing solutions. GAF has been around for 130 years and makes the best
shingles out there. Can you describe some tools and resources that you have to
help homeowners to match you up with a quality certified contractor who can
install the GAF product?
Ralph: So,
a lot of what we do internally and externally, to a certain degree with digital
marketing and social media, we really push the Master Elites forward. So we
have various types of blogs and searches and contractor locators, and if
customers are on our website and they're looking for a contractor, they go to
the contractor locator, they type in their address, and we're going to send
them the Master Elites that are within that zip code or service range.
And then the Master Elites are even evaluated and rated
based on a couple of different things with utilization of our program. Have
they won awards with us? What is their ratings, 4.9, 5.0? We do a lot to help
that customer choose our Master Elite contractors.
Installing the GAF Roofing
System
John: And
then, Brett, can you talk a little bit about the installation of the GAF
roofing system and how Master Roofers certifies their workers to install GAF
shingles and roofing products?
Brett: Yeah,
that's a great question, John. Well, GAF provides a wonderful infrastructure.
So first of all, they're offering the certification for the company. So a
Master Elite certification, which has several components to it. It involves
warranties, it involves training, continuing ed, if you will, and several other
components to make sure, as a company, we are staying on the cutting edge and
we are staying current in the best solutions in roofing and the best solutions
in GAF's products.
The other part that's in there is they offer a tremendous
suite of educational tools, available to us, that what we do here at Master
Roofers, in addition to maintaining our certification as a company, all of our
project managers, all of our roofing technicians go through and they gain
certifications in their area of specialty, so steep slope roof certification,
stuff on that process. So they know, to Ralph's point, on how to do that actual
roofing system, how to do that assembly, they gain a certification on it. They
can also manage other people on crews to ensure that they are following the
factory designed system, if you will, that is that assembly that gives them
that top quality roof.
The other thing that we do as well, is we only use -- Ralph
had mentioned earlier -- someone may use a really high-grade GAF shingle, but
then other parts of the assembly, maybe they go off-book, they go to a lower
grade underlayment, they go to a lower grade ice and water shield. We don't do
that. We actually stay with the factory assembly. Everything that we do is
going to be 100% compliant there. So we're using that entire suite of products
that is specified by the manufacturer, and we are putting that roof down in the
way that is specified by the manufacturer. And the people who are doing it are
certified in doing so.
So on an individual level, that man on your roof who's
running that crew, he's certified, he knows exactly what he's doing, he knows
how to also inspect that everyone is doing everything. And then on a company
level, we're holding our employees accountable to making sure that we're
following all those systems. So it's really about following the system, right
Ralph? I mean, it's about doing it the right way.
Ralph: And
that's my job these days. As I might've said before, June 4th will be my 40th
year anniversary with GAF, continuous employee. I spent nine years out in
Columbus, Ohio until I was fortunate enough that my wife and I and my three
kids ended up moving back to New York state. But about a year and a half ago,
GAF came and said, "Hey, we got an idea. Why don't you come over to our
care training division?" Because we need the expertise to be able to not
only teach the installers, but also a big part of my job is teaching the sales
guys how to communicate with Fred and Mary at the dining room table, so they
understand exactly what's about to happen, what the process is, how the
products perform, and what their functions are. So that when it gets down to
production, there's no disconnect between, well, Johnny at the sales guy said
this, but your production manager says that. And so we try to make sure we take
away all of those overlaps and it's seamless from start to finish.
Quality Control Inspections
John: Are
you going out at all? Do you have any quality control inspections or anything
like that where you're going out on a job with Master Roofers and checking to
make sure that they're using all GAF products and doing the installation
properly or anything like that? Or is that just all sort of part of the certification
process?
Ralph: Right
now, there's an honesty policy that's involved here. The 14 page legal
agreement that he signed talks about running a legitimate company and achieving
homeowner satisfactions. When we first launched this Master Elite program in
1997, we did try to inspect as many Golden Pledge roofs as possible, as a
courtesy, but the manpower was just overwhelming. And so we kind of backed off
on that. So we do sometimes look at a roof occasionally. We'll just do a little
audit. We also look at complaints too. So if he gets a complaint on a roof and
the consumer calls us, well, that's going to tip off a little bit of an
inspection process. So the honesty policy right now is that he's going to stay
in the lines as best as he can, represent us, him and the consumer, again, with
the most professional level that he possibly can. And if something happens,
we'll figure it out.
Brett: Yeah.
Our goal as a contractor is to be a hundred percent compliant. If there's ever
a situation where we were not, it's an inadvertent error. And from our point of
view, again, being a longstanding company, we take the responsibility for that,
but our goal is always to be 100% compliant with the program. I would like
nothing more than if Ralph wanted to go inspect every Golden Pledge roof we
had. Our goal is to say, "hey, go ahead." I don't want to be the guy that's
scared that someone's going to find something. So it's a lot easier to do a
great job and follow the process than it is to hope you don't get caught later.
So we just want to be compliant and do it exactly the way we should every
single time.
Ralph: Yeah,
and I'll say this, we protect the Master Elite program very, very hard. We want
to make sure everybody's compliant. And if somebody goes off the deep end a
little bit and their lack of quality goes down, their interaction with
consumers starts to be questionable, we'll pull the program from them. And I've
done that many times, unfortunately, with either certified contractors would
kind of go bad or I've had a couple of Master Elites who we've had to take out
of the program. It's not pretty for anybody when that happens. And so the guys
that are compliant and stay within the lines, they do very well. And that's all
we ask for.
What Should a Homeowner Look
for in a Roofing Contractor?
John: From
the homeowner's perspective, is there anything else that a homeowner should
look for in a roofing contractor besides just trying to find a Master Elite
contractor that's certified by GAF? Are there other things that a homeowner
should look for?
Ralph: Absolutely.
I am a huge, huge, huge component of you must have an attic inspection program.
You can't diagnose what's going on with the whole structure. There's an
atmosphere underneath those roofs that you don't know what's going on. The lack
of insulation, the lack of proper ventilation, could be mold conditions. You
could have bath fans and everything pouring into that attic. You could have
bulk leaking around chimneys. And if you have HVAC systems up there, the
contractor before they really advise a homeowner has to have a good working
knowledge of what's going on underneath that roof before they can start selling
the top side. Okay, so that's one, attic inspections.
Number two is, I think, one of the biggest keys of
investing and offering a new roof is really ventilation. Ventilation itself is
a huge science. There's so many variables in every single house. There's almost
always some type of a deficiency somewhere that could cause problems. And so if
you become proficient in ventilation, that's where the most of the problems
come from. Nailing the shingles on is kind of the easy thing. It's preparing
that building. And so sometimes I equate this like you take your car into the
auto shop, you might need brakes. Well, they're walking back and forth
underneath your car looking at it, and he might come up and say, "Hey, did
you know you had a broken shock in the back?" No, I didn't. Well, his
obligation is to not sell you the shock, but to let you know, because if you
leave the driveway and then you discover the shock's broken, you're going to
try to blame him.
Now that happens in roofing where Johnny Smith comes up,
they tear a roof off, they put a roof on, but they didn't do anything
underneath it. The same condition that was existing before is reoccurring, so
they blame the roof, and it's not the roof, it's the structure. And then you
think about all the other tie-ins with siding, windows, J-channels, flashings
of all kinds, chimneys that are absorbing moisture like a sponge and leaking on
the inside. So there's so many ancillary connections to a roof that all really
need to be analyzed.
And in my opinion, you give the customer options of, okay,
I'm a little concerned about A, B and C. Here's the scope of work. Here's the
price. What would you like me to do? What don't you want me to do? And I'm a
big proponent of giving the customer, you don't want to overwhelm them with too
much, but you got to protect your liability on this job. And when you give a customer
options, when they opt out of a scope of work, then that kind of falls back on
the homeowner for not making that decision. There's a really big investigative
process that I think has to happen before you even sit down and talk about roof
shingles.
Brett: Great
point. Great point. We believe a lot in transparency, and you're right, last
time I checked, we all help out adults that are homeowners and they have
choices to make, and everyone has a different budget, different situation. We
understand that. And we'd just like to be fully transparent to them on what the
situation is and then what we feel the appropriate options are and help them
choose.
And you're absolutely right. Really, it's a whole
ecosystem that you're taking care of there. I think most people just think that
you're banging some tar paper and some shingles on the roof and that's it. And
it's so much more than that, when it's done right. We like to say here that
there are roofers and then there are Master Roofers. We're real proud of the
fact that we are a roofing company. We're not a door and siding company that
does roofs. I'm not a framer that does roofs. I'm not a home jack-of-all-trades
that does roofs. We are a professional roofing company, and you're absolutely
right, Ralph, that involves all of those things that you outlined and being
able to help diagnose those accurately and help the homeowner with them.
If I was going to give any advice to a homeowner as well,
I would say if you need to address an issue or replace a roof on your home,
really look at roofers. I think sometimes it's become mixed. There's a lot of
companies out there that do a lot of stuff, roofing is one of them. They may or
may not be particularly good roofers. I'm not disparaging anyone, but when you
work with a company where what they do is roofing, if they've been around for a
while, they're probably pretty good at it. So again, if you're looking at
getting the roof replaced, Joe's we-do-everything-on-a-home, they may or may
not be proficient roofers, I don't know. But if you work with a company that
does nothing but roofing and is certified by a major manufacturer like GAF, you
can sleep pretty well at night knowing that you're hiring someone who's a professional,
and that you're going to get a professional system installed. And so we try and
be really good at one thing, roofing, that's what we do here.
Ralph: And
I like that. And I like to think of it this way as you're the classic, small,
individually owned American company whose product happens to be roofing.
Brett: Correct.
Ralph: You're
not a roofer per se. You're a small business whose product is roofing.
Brett: Well
put.
John: All
right, well, we'll leave it at that. And thanks again for joining us. Ralph
Finizio from GAF. Thanks again.
Ralph: I
had a lot of fun. Thanks. And if you want to do this again, any other topic,
just hook me up.
John: Absolutely.
And as always, Brett Rogenski, thanks again for joining us.
Brett: Thanks
so much, John. You have a great day.
John: And
for more information about Master Roofers, visit the website at
masterroofers.com or call (603) 623-4973.